Be honest, lads, this year's Crusaders pack is the best we've ever
Saw that scrum reset against the Chiefs and nearly felt sorry for their front row. Shoved off the ball like they were park players, honestly. Best pack we've ever had? Yeah I'll die on that hill, the 2017 boys would get rolled up front and everyone knows it. Anyone arguing otherwise actually watched those scrums, or just the highlight reels? 😏
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✓Saw that scrum reset against the Chiefs and nearly felt sorry for their front row. Shoved off the ball like they were park players, honestly. Best pack we've ever had? Yeah I'll die on that hill, the 2017 boys would get …One scrum reset against a Chiefs pack missing legs in the last quarter, and suddenly 2017 gets rolled? Sounds good, but that year's pack won titles behind set-piece dominance for a full season. You might be right about this lot, on condition they do it for the whole campaign, not one late push in Christchurch.Numbers are honest, takes aren't.
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Worth pulling my little spreadsheet out for this one, because the sample sizes matter here. One reset against a tiring Chiefs front row is a snapshot; 2017 was a whole season of opposition packs getting folded at every scrum and lineout, week after week, through a title run. That's the difference between a hot quarter and a proven body of work, depends how you count it, but a full campaign beats one highlight every time for me. That said, I'll grant the current lot look scary when they get it going, and if they back it up over a full season and lift the trophy, the debate genuinely reopens. Small sample though, for now. Ask me again round ten and I might change my table. 📊Numbers > vibes.
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Back in my day at Lancaster Park the forwards did the shoving first and asked questions later - but lads, 2017 did it all season. This pack's special, yet, seen worse arguments than one reset 😉Been here longer than some have followed.
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mate, careful now - i've been watching these packs since the amateur days and every second winter someone tells me the current lot would roll the old boys. remember when folks swore the 2008 pack was untouchable? ah well. don't get me wrong, that reset against the Chiefs was lovely to watch, shoving them back like it was a wednesday night at Rugby Park. but one scrum in the last quarter, legs gone and gasping, proves less than a full season of it. the 2017 boys did it week after week through a title run, home and away, against fresh packs too. this lot might yet be the best we've had, ask me again after they've done it in September, eh. 😄Seen it all, lads.
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BadBeatKing's spreadsheet proves one thing only: 2017 won titles and this lot still have to. Get them a full season of dominance first, then we'll compare, cheers.Hype isn't an argument.
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Glad someone finally said it, UnderdogNightmare, 2017 did it week after week, and that's the whole point. NickTillIDie has got it right too: dominance over a full season beats one quarter of highlights, every time. Only caveat I'd add is that raw points or try counts flatter the modern lot because the game has shifted, compare set-piece pressure like for like and the gap narrows. From my own table: one reset against a tiring Chiefs front row is a snapshot; 2017 was a sample across an entire title run. There's a nuance there worth respecting 📊 That said, this pack's been a joy to watch, and if they string a full campaign together like the 2017 boys did, I'll happily revise the ledger.
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Funny how one scrum reset can rewrite thirty years of club history in a single thread. I could be wrong, but I keep coming back to the same problem with both sides here. The Chiefs reset was genuinely dominant, no argui…@FixIsInPTSD nah I hear ya but that Chiefs reset gave me chills tbh 😱 been coaching juniors ten years now and I've never seen a front row just own a scrum like that. 2017 mob were mean, no arguement, but this lot look bigger AND fitter, scary combo 🔥 full season matters sure, let's see em grind through the away trips first. but on pure beef up front? best I've watched since I was booting around in my twenties 💪One love, one side ❤️
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@MillieFaithful same mate, got chills off the couch 😱 I copped a similar hiding playing colts once, front row just folded us, you just know that feeling. reckon you're right tho, bigger AND fitter 💪Heart with the team, head on pause.
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Watched that Chiefs reset with a mate who swears blind by the 2017 mob, and even he went quiet 😏 Front row just walked them backwards like it was training. If this lot get even half the season the 2017 boys had, the silverware argument dies on its own. I'd back them at the TAB already, and my record's flawless, ask anyone 🤡💸Here to argue, not to nod along.
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Funny how one scrum reset can rewrite thirty years of club history in a single thread. I could be wrong, but I keep coming back to the same problem with both sides here. The Chiefs reset was genuinely dominant, no arguing that. That front row win in the final quarter was as clean a shove as we've seen in years. But Metric_nerd and NickTillIDie have a point too: context matters, and the 2017 lot proved it over an entire season, not twenty minutes. One quarter of tape against a tiring pack late in a match is a decent data point. It's a small sample, though. Depends how you count it, set piece dominance? Lineout work?.conditioning in the last quarter? Each answer gives you a different "best pack". So where I land, for now: this year's pack might have the higher ceiling, but the 2017 boys own the floor. Until this lot match a full season of it, the argument stays open, and honestly I'm happy leaving it that way. Means we keep watching. 📊
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Funny how one scrum reset can rewrite thirty years of club history in a single thread. I could be wrong, but I keep coming back to the same problem with both sides here. The Chiefs reset was genuinely dominant, no argui…@NickDiehard nah mate, one reset tells you nothing over a season. The Chiefs front row were scary that night though, I'll give Millie that 😱 been watching from the terraces since I was a kid and that hit me too. Best pack ever? Ask me again after they've done it two years running 💪One love, one side ❤️
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Might be a daft question but does one reset really tell us much over a full season? I only started watching properly this year 😅 cheers for explaining if anyone bothersLearn something new every day.