Waikato beats Manawatu then loses twice in a row - what went wrong?
Gutted we couldn't make the trip north but watching that Northland game hurt π€ still buzzing after the Manawatu win though, boys looked sharp at FMG that night π₯ Big one in Wellington on the 27th, backing them all day, get in! πͺπ
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βWhipsaw month ay π± 36 one week then 14 against Canty at home?? Fix the defence before Wellington or the 27th gonna be another long night π€¬πͺ
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Interesting how the narrative flips on one game, Canterbury thumped us at FMG, so "fortress home form" is a shaky story already. The 36-point outburst against Manawatu tells me the attack was fine that night; it's the 14 and 17 totals either side of it that scream execution breakdown when the defence gets organised. Small sample though, three rounds says very little about whether it's set piece or structure, so I'd hold judgement until Wellington away on the 27th gives us a proper away test before Tasman come to Hamilton. π
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Interesting how everyone was calling FMG a fortress after one cosy win over Manawatu, then Canterbury and Northland stacked 70 points on Waikato in a fortnight π Defence, surely, you don't ship scores like that if the set piece is holding. Take the 27th in Wellington with the TAB if you rate them, easy NZ$ for the rest of us. Still waiting for the fanboys to explain that Northland scoreline though π€‘Any stat can be bent.
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watched a few sides ship 70 in a fortnight over the years and most of them weren't defending badly, they'd simply stopped competing at the breakdown. andy's quick to blame defence but the Canterbury game at FMG was lost up front long before the line got stretched, you give them slow ball all night and even a tidy defensive shape starts looking ragged. ah, but I'll needle the other side too: 36 against Manawatu flattered nobody, yet old school folk like me remember when Waikato would grind out 14:13 wins in the mud and call it a good day's work. scoring won't save you if the set piece coughs it up in Wellington on the 27th. that trip will tell us plenty more than the Tasman game at home, where they'll lift for the crowd whatever's broken. ah well, we'll seeSeen it all, lads.
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Canty game I was there, forwards got bullied from kick-off, no forwards no defence mate π€¬ Fix the pack or Wellington will be ugly ah well, nowt to do πͺYou don't abandon your own.
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watch as long as i have and you'll get it. One tidy home win means nothing till you back it up. Wellington away on the 27th will tell us more than the tasman crowd ever will πBeen here longer than some have followed.
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Nah the nerds have it half right imo πͺ breakdown is where the Canty game died, we all saw it, but the week before at Northland they were getting turned over on their OWN ball, that's a skill thing not just attitude. Front foot dies and the midfield defence is standing flat-footed all night, simples π€ Wellington away on the 27th will tell us way more than Tasman at home tbh. Anyone can front up in front of a home crowd after a hidingβ¦ but go to the capital with the pack fixed or not, that's where you find out who they actually are. Backing them through thick and thin regardless ππ₯One love, one side β€οΈ
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Back in the day we used to say a forward pack is like a good cuppa, you don't notice it till someone's made it weak π And honestly that's where my doubt sits here. Everyone's quick to point at the breakdown, and fair enough, Metric_nerd's got half a point, but I watched that Canterbury night and it was older than that. Canty simply wanted it more from the first whistle, and once a side smells that, no drill at training sorts it by Tuesday. What amuses me is the two-versus-two debate: one lot says defence, other lot says set piece, and nobody wants to admit it might just be a young lot who play like gods when the crowd's behind them and like strangers when it isn't. Home 36:27, home 14:36, away 17:34 - seen worse, don't panic. But UnderdogNightmare is right on the money: Wellington on the 27th tells us plenty more than a comfy Tasman evening at FMG ever will. Away form's the honest mirror, always has been πWatch as long as I have and you'll get it.
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Hate to say it but I watched the Canty game from the couch screaming at the telly and the maul defence was the thing that broke me π± every time they rolled within ten metres of our line it felt like a done deal. Fix that and the pack gets its confidence back, simple as that tbh. And nah, Undie's got a point but I'll take it further. Wellington away on the 27th is the whole season in one game aren't they just gonna fold like they did in WhangΔrei? π€ If the boys turn up angry and fix the turnover disease FullbackNut mentioned, then fine, I'll believe. Backing them either way though, always do πͺπIn the stands since I was a kid.
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ha, UncleAllDay, the maul broke you too eh? it broke half of hamilton i reckon. but here's my gentle needle at you young fellas blaming one thing, canty rolled us at the maul, sure, but up in whangarei a week later the lineout itself was leaking, so which came first, the crooked throw or the soft defence behind it? chicken and egg, if you ask me. back in my day we'd just say the pack had lost its snarl and stop overthinking it π seen it a hundred times, one bad home hiding and suddenly everyone's a forwards coach. the manawatu night they looked ten foot tall, canty made them look like schoolboys, and that swing inside three weeks tells you more about heads than any breakdown drill. Wellington away on the 27th will sort the truth out quick enough; the tasman lot at fmg won't scare anyone.Remember when the grass was greener π±
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Maul defence broke Canty, lineout broke Northland, pack's been stitched up twice π€ Wellington on the 27th will tell us if the forwards fronted up, backing them all day πͺYou don't abandon your own.
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Ha, half the thread wants to blame one thing and the other half wants to blame everything π seen it all before though - a wet Saturday in Hamilton, Canterbury rolling a maul from the 22 and suddenly everyone's a forward coach. Truth is one score against Manawatu proves sweet nothing, so I'm with MatchdayTillIDie: Wellington on the 27th is the real tell, away soil doesn't lie.Seen it all, lads.
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everyone's quick to fix the maul like it's a leaky tap, but back in the day Colin Meads would've said the same thing happens every winter and you just fix it on the training paddock π my worry is the away thing, three home games in the schedule soon and only one away trip tells you more than any lineout throw. if the boys can't handle Wellington's Shed noise on the 27th, no amount of maul drilling sorts it. seen worse seasons start though π
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FrontRow88 is onto it tbh, away form's the real tell. Home wins don't mean much when you fold 17:34 up north π€ Wellington 27th sorts the pretenders from the real deal πOne love, one side β€οΈ
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Away form's the tell, aye? One trip north and suddenly we're writing them off π I've seen worse Mooloo sides sort themselves mid-season, let's see Wellington first.Watch as long as I have and you'll get it.
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Scraped past Manawatu at home then leaked 34 up north, that's defence to me π€ fix the tackling and the away form fixes itself π€¬πͺOne love, one side β€οΈ
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Millie, the tackling talk makes sense until you look at the Canterbury game - we leaked 36 at home that night, so defence was already leaking water before we ever left town. The Northland trip just showed the same cracks, didn't hide them. Back in the day we used to say you find out who you are on the road, and fair enough, Wellington on the 27th will tell us plenty. But watch as long as I have and you'll get it: one wet night in WhangΔrei and one thrashing isn't a season. I've seen worse Mooloo sides stagger through September and still turn up when it mattered. OldSchoolEst has it right β let's see the trip south before we start burying anyone πSeen it all, trust me.
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Fanatic's got the right of it I reckon. Defence was leaking against Canterbury at home before anyone packed a bus north, 36 points conceded on your own patch tells you the cracks were there all along. Millie, you're half right, but it's deeper than missed tackles. Seen this before though, back in the day Mooloo sides used to wobble through September then find their spine. The Wellington trip on the 27th will tell us more than the Tasman game will, that's for sure, good side, hostile ground, no hiding. I'll be watching that one with a quiet beer rather than a TAB multi on it, learned my lesson there years ago π Patience, fellas. The season's long.Remember when the grass was greener π±