Are these Hurricanes the best top-of-table side Super Rugby Pacific
Genuine question for the thread: these Hurricanes or the Crusaders sides of old - who's the stronger top-of-table machine? π₯ 55 points off 14 rounds, 562 put past teams vs 298 conceded... that's the full package surely?? Give me your pick πͺ
11 posts
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βStrong pick, Josh, but I'd still take the Crusaders dynasty purely on the trophy count, titles are the criterion that settles these arguments, and this Hurricanes side has banked nothing yet. That said, the form line reads WWWLW with 562 points for and 298 against after 14 rounds, and only three losses all season, which stacks up against any Crusaders regular season I've charted. There's a nuance here though: 14 rounds is a decent sample for the table, but a single finals series can flip the verdict, and the Crusaders of old won when it mattered.
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So a trophy none of these blokes have lifted yet beats what's actually on the table? I backed them at the TAB in March, sure thing mate π€‘π
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FixIsInPTSD has a point on trophies, but a fairer comparison needs the same slice of season, the Crusaders dynasty was judged over years, the Hurricanes have played 14 rounds. Give them a full campaign and a title before crowning them; consistency across 14 matches with a +264 differential is elite, but one good season isn't a dynasty. On condition that they finish it, sure.Numbers are honest, takes aren't.
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Funny thing, the young lot never saw the Crusaders side that just refused to lose, and trophies were the proof in the end. These Hurricanes have been a treat to watch, mind, 562 points tells you plenty, but watch as long as I have and you'll learn the table in June means little once the finals roll round. Bank a title first, then we'll talk dynasty. πRemember when the grass was greener π±
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Seen worse tables mean nothing, that's for sure. I sat through plenty of June nights at Carisbrook when the top side got tipped out a week later, so the sceptics here aren't mad. Still, two things amuse me. MatchdayTillIDie and FixIsInPTSD keep reaching for trophies like the Crusaders won theirs before the semis rolled round, every dynasty was also "just a table side" at this exact point of the season once. And Fullback_Faithful backing them at the TAB in March then acting smug about it... mate, the punter who brags early is the one who cries loudest in August π 11 wins, 562 points, 298 against. That defence and attack together is rare enough. Let the finals settle the trophy question, but as a top-of-table side through 14 rounds? Seen worse, that's all I'll say. πBeen here longer than some have followed.
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562 points in 14 rounds and you lot are still clutching finals trauma from Carisbrook π Stats like that don't luck into existence, mate. π€‘Here to argue, not to nod along.
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I could be wrong, but the point that gets lost in this thread is the zero in the draws column. Eleven wins, three losses, no draws after 14 rounds, that's a side that closes games out, and it's the bit of the table I trust most in June. A draw means you let the opposition back in; these blokes haven't let anyone split the points with them once. And Josh's 562-298 split is genuinely rare, when attack and defence both sit at that level simultaneously, that's usually the marker of a real top seed rather than a lucky run of home fixtures. MatchdayTillIDie is right that the table in June means little, mind. I keep my own columns every round and the pattern I look for is whether the losses cluster or scatter; three losses spread across the campaign with form reading WWWLW looks like a wobble, not a crack. Finals are a different animal though, one off night and the whole conversation changes. So my answer is: best full-package side the competition's seen at this stage, yes.Do the math before you argue.
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Chris is onto something with the zero draws, that's the bit I'd back too - no sideshow draws, they either win or they don't. But 562-298 against nobody in particular proves little until someone lands a punch in the finals. I watched plenty of June champions-in-waiting up here get sorted a fortnight later. Show me a semifinal won ugly and I'll listen.Numbers are honest, takes aren't.
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Never mind the table, watch how they close matches. When a game's in the balance late, our lot just find another gear π€ You can coach defence, you can drill attack, that killer instinct in the last ten? Can't teach it. Final punch will come when it comes π₯
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Reading the whole thread, most of us lean towards yes on the full package question, because the zero draws plus 562-298 says they close games from both ends, and Touchline's point about that late gear is hard to argue with. The counterweight, which GloryDays and I both flag, is that 562-298 came against nobody in particular, so the Crusaders-of-old comparison only gets settled in June. I could be wrong, but I'd rather be sitting on 55 points with question marks than without them.Do the math before you argue.