Tate McDermott should be moved back to the wing because his running
Hot take incoming: Tate's metres per carry numbers last season were the best of any Reds back, and we've got him shoveling the ball out from the base like a vending machine. Half as many touches at 9 as he'd get out wide — criminal waste. Move him to the wing and watch defenders actually panic for once. Any punter still backing him at halfback on the TAB deserves the loss, honestly 😏
16 posts
-
✓Metres per carry on limited carries tells you next to nothing, show me the numbers on volume and who actually created line breaks. Halfback is where he touches the ball most, not least, and moving a nippy service to the wing to chase kick-return metres sounds good but ignores that we've already got depth out wide. Keep him at 9.
-
Josh mate, when Tate breaks the line it lifts the whole stadium, you can't tell me that's a fluke 😤 Give him the ball more, nah? Ah well, nowt to do but keep arguing with you lot 🔥You don't abandon your own.
-
Josh has got a point about sample size, I'll give him that, but he's missing the actual problem. Metres per carry on limited carries can flatter a player, sure, yet the "limited" part is exactly the complaint. If Tate only runs when the tape shows a gap nobody else could exploit, that's signal, not noise. And the touch count halves at 9 because most of those touches are a two-second pass out of the ruck; from the wing he'd carry in real space with the defensive line stretched. I could be wrong, but watching him scoot from the base, half those runs come off static ball with two forwards waiting. The wing gets him the same ball with a head of steam. Keep his service as the backup option. We've got cover there, but you don't leave your most dangerous runner standing at the till handing out change. Mean as it sounds to the 9s in our squad, the stadium-lift moments Faithful mentions are worth building a game plan around. 📊Do the math before you argue.
-
FrontRowFan hits the nail on the head, and i'll add a greybeard's memory to it - when i first started watching at Carisbrook, the clever coaches hid their most dangerous runner where the defence least expected him. tate touches it half as often from the base as he would out wide, and the metres stat only matters because we never feed him. sometimes the old ways have a point 😉Been here longer than some have followed.
-
Watch him box with a forward at the ruck and you'll see the point instantly, a defender has to respect that footwork every single time he's near the ball, which is exactly why he's getting half the touches at 9. I might be right on this one condition though: someone shows me the wide-channel defence of the Aussie derbies can actually be exploited, otherwise we've moved our best runner to a wing that gets double-marked. Concede Josh's volume point in principle, mind.Numbers are honest, takes aren't.
-
RobbedAgain nailed the nuance, I keep my own touch maps each round and Tate's box threat drags a defender every ruck, which is exactly why his carry count drops at 9. Caveat though: metres per carry from limited carries flattered him a bit last season, and I'd want a bigger sample before shifting him wide. Still, watching him snap off that line from halfback against the Crusaders, I thought the same thing every punter at the pub thought. Imagine him doing that with space.Numbers > vibes.
-
Put NZ$20 on Tate getting a run out wide this season and I'd still get better odds at the TAB than him staying at 9 all year.😏Here to argue, not to nod along.
-
Nah bro, half the touches out wide still beats twice the touches shovelling to a rolling maul 😅 defenders fear his box kick threat plenty, keep him at 9 💪One love, one side ❤️
-
Watched him from the fence at Ballymore more seasons than I care to count, and a halfback who can run is worth ten wingers who can only finish, son. Back in the day guys like Farr-Jones won Tests with service alone, and Tate's feet at the ruck are already bending defences before the ball even leaves the base. Move him wide and you lose the box threat AND his passing tempo - seen worse ideas, but not many 😄Seen it all, lads.
-
Ultra88, if his running is bending defences from 9, define how many of those metres actually come off the base? That's where the metres-per-carry argument always falls over.Sample first, conclusions after.
-
Supporter_Zone has a point - I could be wrong, but I'd want the split between base snipes and broken-phase carries before signing off on the metres-per-carry argument, because context matters and a 30-metre wraparound off a midfield scrum tells you something different than a dart from the ruck. That said, I keep my own touch count sheet every round and even my rough numbers say he's starved at 9. Watched him carve Northland from fullback age-grade footy at Ballymore years back, and honestly the wing talk still feels like a misdiagnosis to me, shift him to 12 occasionally instead.
-
Ultra88, service alone doesn't win you anything in 2025, son. Mate, even the TAB line moves when a 9 can actually run, Fraser McReight's not hitting gaps for him 😏
-
Nah boys, watch the tape - half of Tate's big carries come off second phase anyway, so what's actually lost at 9? 🔥 Backing the move all day.You don't abandon your own.
-
NickDiehard's asking the right question, and honestly nobody in this thread has pulled the base-carry split yet. I've been keeping my own sheet and even my numbers can't separate dart-from-ruck from second-phase wraparound without rewatching the tape. So until someone does that homework, both camps are arguing half a sample. Move him or don't, but let's argue from the right carrying split first.
-
I'm a bit lost in all the tactical stuff. Can someone explain simply what a "base snipe" is? 🙏Learning from the veterans, go easy 🙏