Honest question, fam: is our pack actually good enough to win another
Watched our scrum get shoved backwards for three weeks straight and some of you still reckon the pack is title-grade, that's laughable really π The backs are bailing out the forwards every single week, it's the forwards coasting on the backs, not the other way round. Wait for the fanboys to pile in telling me scrums win championships π€‘π
13 posts
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βOutscored everyone those three weeks though. Show me a pack getting shunted that still wins that way. Maybe the set piece needs work, on condition we keep winning while it does.Numbers are honest, takes aren't.
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Scrum's creaking sure, but our lot still outscored everyone those three weeks π€ fix the set piece and nobody's touching us π₯πͺHeart with the team, head on pause.
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Outscoring everyone three weeks running while the scrum creaks says the whole side functions, mate. I keep my own table, and that's a backs-heavy split for sure. But winning while faulty beats winning pretty.Do the math before you argue.
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Seen worse packs win titles, believe me. Back in the amateur days the old fellas used to say a scrum that creaks in April can be iron by August, coaches fix it mid-season, and the backs keeping you winning while they do is a luxury not a curse. Patience, young fellas πWatch as long as I have and you'll get it.
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OldSchoolEst66 nailed the April-to-August point, that's exactly how I remember previous seasons going. I could be wrong, but a scrum under pressure in week three tells you more about the opposition's front row depth than about ours being title-grade or not. Where I'd add the caveat: winning while faulty only holds if the fault isn't structural. Three weeks of getting shunted at Waikato Stadium is a pattern, and patterns in the tight five tend to compound once the season sharpens up. My own tracking has the backs carrying the bulk of the scoring in that stretch, which is fine in April, less fine in a semifinal when the rain comes down at FMG Stadium and everything gets compressed. Context matters, and so does who you're playing. If the set piece holds even at neutral in the second half of the season, I'd back this lot all the way π
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Nick's got a point about front row depth, funny how the "shunting" conveniently stopped being our problem the moment we won anyway π Taking the TAB line on us anyway, anyone dares? π€‘πΈShow me your ROI first π
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Gotta push back a bit lads π Nick, week three telling you about THEIR front row? Nah mate, three weeks straight at Waikato getting shunted is OUR problem no matter who's on the other side of it. StatHead taking the TAB line while mocking the pack is classic punter logic. Take our money and hope the forwards prove you wrong π Honestly though I'm with OldSchoolEst66 more than I'd like to admit. Remember being at the 2013 final, pack got monstered early and we still found a way, Ah well, nowt to do but trust the coaches to sort the set piece. Backs keeping us top of the table while they fix it is a bloody luxury π₯You don't abandon your own.
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seen worse packs win titles, and ours kept outscoring everyone while the front row gets sorted. give it till mid-season, ah well, we'll see πSeen it all, lads.
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SeenItAllFaithful actually framed it better than most here - whose problem is it when the shunt happens at your own ground? I'll concede the pack might be fine on one condition: show me one week where the front row holds and we still look this sharp off second-phase ball. Otherwise the backs are papering over cracks and everyone's calling it depth. Receipts please, mid-season at the latest.Hype isn't an argument.
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Nick's condition is a fair test, but there's a nuance here: a front row can hold for one week against a soft scrum and tell you nothing, three weeks of shunting tells you more. My tables say the backs are masking it for now, though that's a small sample when the draw hasn't thrown a proper scrumming side at us yet. Ask me again after we've played someone with a genuine tight five, then we'll know who's carrying whom. π
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Nick's condition is a fair test, but there's a nuance here: a front row can hold for one week against a soft scrum and tell you nothing, three weeks of shunting tells you more. My tables say the backs are masking it for β¦@FixIsInPTSD love how you blokes need three weeks of stats to say what a shunted scrum shows in one π I'll put $20 at the TAB the pack folds first. Sure thing, mate π€‘
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Nick's test is too easy to pass against a soft pack, agreed with FixIsInPTSD there. Judge it on away scrums too - I could be wrong, but home ref leeway skews week-to-week reads. πDo the math before you argue.